#DIMPLEGATE – Titleist Sues 10 Small Ball Companies
News

#DIMPLEGATE – Titleist Sues 10 Small Ball Companies

#DIMPLEGATE – Titleist Sues 10 Small Ball Companies

You serve me, and I’ll serve you
Swing your partners, all get screwed
Bring your lawyer, and I’ll bring mine
Get together, and we could have a bad time
              – “Sue Me, Sue You Blues,” George Harrison

Written By: John Barba

George wrote that one about all the legal hullabaloo surrounding the Beatles break-up.  If he’d lived long enough, I wonder what George would have to say about the legal wrangling over golf balls?

The latest golf ball Legal-Go-Round stars – who else – Acushnet/Titleist as the plaintiff, and ten direct-sale competitors who, collectively, are the defendants.

At the heart of this latest episode of LA Law is something called a “triangular dipyramid dimple pattern.”

Who’s Being Sued

Back in April Acushnet filed suit in Federal Court in Boston, claiming that ten competitors are violating Acushnet’s patented “triangular dipyramid dimple pattern” with their offerings.

the-10

The named defendants are:

A Common Factory, A Common Problem

golf-1

As coincidence would have it, the same factory in Taiwan, which is not named in the suit, manufactures all of the golf balls in question. This factory also makes balls for a a number of OEM’s, including Wilson. Unlike the defendants, Wilson, it should be noted, designs and engineers its own balls, and was not named in the suit.

The companies named as defendants are, by and large, very small entities. In some cases we’re talking about websites, logos, and a marketing hook. Some of these guys are basically operating out of basements or garages.  The reasonable inference is that these companies relied on the Taiwanese manufacturer for many aspects – if not all – of the design, engineering, and production of their golf balls. That would include the triangular dipyramid dimple pattern in question.

Acushnet is seeking an injunction and damages, and is demanding a jury trial.  As it stands now, nearly everyone is lawyering-up and no one is talking specifics on the record.

Some Background:

honorableMention

According to Courthouse News Service, Acushnet’s 30-page lawsuit describes in detail its patented “triangular dipyramid dimple pattern.”  Acushnet says the pattern reduces both lift and drag, “causing the ball to fly along a more penetrating ball flight.”

“For optimal golf ball trajectory, the goal is to develop a ball with optimal balance of lift and drag forces, not merely to minimize drag while maximizing lift. A ball that simply maximizes lift risks flying too high, which can cause reduced accuracy and possibly reduced distance.”

Acushnet’s claim is centered around three patents from 2003-2004. Those patents were the foundation of what would become the ProV1x; the alternative to the ProV1 which, in addition to other differences, has 60 fewer dimples. The patents in question, according to Courthouse News, “combine lower dimple coverage with multiple dimple sizes to provide high dimple coverage and improved aerodynamic characteristics.”

Acushnet says all ten defendants use that very same pattern; 318 dimples in three different sizes.

Yep, it seems someone counted all those dimples.

brevet

Perry Mason Returns…

As any good GolfSpy knows, this isn’t the first time Acushnet/Titleist has been “balls-deep” inside of a courtroom.

In 2005, Bridgestone sued Acushnet over solid core, multi-piece ball patents.  They settled out of court two years later, with Acushnet paying Bridgestone a license fee and ongoing royalties on certain patents while non-royalty cross-licensing covered the others.

And then there was the five-year golf jihad between Acushnet and Callaway over who came up with solid core technology first.  First Callaway won. Then Acushnet won on appeal, and then a Federal Judge refused Callaway’s request for a new trial. Ultimately, the two sides agreed to disagree by reaching a settlement in 2012. No money changed hands, but each company agreed to make golf balls under patents owned by the other.

The First Domino Falls…

3upmgs

It’s been a little over a month, but this latest suit has already claimed its first victim.  In an email to its customers, Rob Zimmerman of 3 Up Golf says he’s getting out of the ball business:

It’s with sadness that I’m writing you today to announce the end of sale date for the 2S14, and that the 3F12 is officially sold out. Unfortunately, we can’t discuss the circumstances which bring us to this stage. We’ve had to make a very tough business decision over the last week and as such, will be winding down our golf ball business.

You can read the full letter here.

Kick X, however, is circling the wagons and firing back:

“We understand why they are targeting us as we are a longer premium ball and one of the fastest growing brands on the market,” said Bob Koch, chief executive officer of Kick X Golf. The TourZ is Longest Premium Ball on the market.

As for the other defendants:

rife-monsta

It’s business as usual at the Boston-based Monsta, which is continuing its aggressive social media sales campaign, widening its offering to include apparel and accessories, and is developing new avenues for selling its products.

Rife is still selling its V-Motion balls on its website, while Lightning has emailed its customers, saying it’s discontinuing its 318 dimple ball, the HL3 SmackDaddy:

So we have some good news and some bad news…The good news is that we are releasing a new golf ball very soon. The bad news is that means the HL3 Smackdaddy will be discontinued.

They still have some HL3 Smackdaddy balls in inventory, which are selling for $25/dozen on the Lightning Golf website.

Vice Golf is based in Europe, and is still selling all of its 318 dimple balls. It has also recently released a new ball, the Vice Pro Plus, which features 336 dimples.

Dixon, which has positioned itself as the “eco-friendly” golf ball, also still lists the 318 dimpled Dixon Fire online. Now listed at  $74.95 per dozen, we can only assume Dixon is trying to offset legal expenses.

I Need The Ball, Arriva, and the Korean-based Saintnine, all continue to market their 318 dimple balls on their respective websites.

What Happens Now?

ball-patent

The legal experts I’ve spoken with say that, even if the defendants didn’t realize the balls they’re marketing are violating patents, they’re likely still liable. Each company is ultimately responsible for its products, and ignorance of existing patents, and their manufacturing partners alleged infringement on those patents certainly doesn’t get them off the hook. Businesses fiercely protect what they feel is their intellectual property. That appears to be what Acushnet is doing in this case.

We could also argue that it’s highly doubtful the total annual sales of all ten defendants combined even puts a dent in 2 weeks worth of Titleist’s ball sales.

Is this a case of the big guy bullying the little guy entrepreneur and swatting them away like flies, or is this a company protecting its intellectual property?

If this ever gets to court, we’ll find out. In the meantime, we have to consider how long some of these smaller companies can hold on before they run out of money. One defendant has already picked up his ball and gone home (even if it may not have actually been its ball to take).

How long can some of the others hold out?

For You

For You

News
Apr 18, 2024
Amazon Finds: The Callaway Swing Easy
Best Drivers for Low Swing Speeds Best Drivers for Low Swing Speeds
Drivers
Apr 17, 2024
Best Drivers For Low Swing Speed Golfers
First Look
Apr 17, 2024
Malbon Is At It Again, This Time With Jimmy Choo
John Barba

John Barba

John Barba

John is an aging, yet avid golfer, writer, 6-point-something handicapper living back home in New England after a 22-year exile in Minnesota. He loves telling stories, writing about golf and golf travel, and enjoys classic golf equipment. “The only thing a golfer needs is more daylight.” - BenHogan

John Barba

John Barba

John Barba

Ask MyGolfSpy: Wilson Golf
Apr 19, 2024 | 22 Comments
We Tried It: Penfold Sunday Stand Bag
Apr 18, 2024 | 5 Comments
Shot Scope V5 Golf Watch
Apr 3, 2024 | 14 Comments
John Barba

John Barba

John Barba





    This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.

      Final Word

      8 years ago

      Well here is an update for anyone who is looking for it, I happen to have some inside knowledge of the proceedings and results of these trials. Well anyone who doesn’t realize this was the big guys pushing around the little guys is wholly kidding themselves. The final result, all but one either left the golf ball industry or stopped making those questionable golf ball. The company manufacturing the ball (Foremost) defended successfully the absurdity of the claims. The only company left standing was Dixon Golf. The patent claims were found to be incorrect, as in similar cases between Apple and Samsung, as a design basis can not be used in patent infringement. As in no one can also patent a sphere over a cube for what you hit is better when it is commonly understood by the mass market to not be unique. In the case of Apple and Samsung, a tablet that had a touch screen was also found to be not defensible as a patent. To think that so many lost their jobs and worse over a big company doing whatever they wanted, only to be found incorrect. I hope those now out of business owners find a good legal argument of their aggressive noncompetitive nature.

      Reply

      Lord FauntLeroy

      8 years ago

      Synopsis of all posts below:

      Titleist owned by Acushnet owned by Fila owned by Koreans owned by Banks is telling a successful golf ball factory in Taiwan to back off because their activity lowers an upcoming IPO. Wilson is funded well enough and connected through capital enough to defend themselves against Titleist’s weak patent claims. (fwiw – Titlelist doesn’t even make a 318 dimple ball at this time, they only patented the idea long ago as a legal maneuver. Titleist has lost numerous patent infringement cases against other ball mfgs. themselves and pays royalties to them because of this).

      * quoted from above – “Acushnet Company, Inc. is planning an initial public offering (IPO) and has selected Solebury Capital to advise the offering expected to be worth around $1.8 billion around 2016, a source with direct knowledge said. The sources stated that Solebury is exploring an early IPO and details on value and venue are yet to be decided. A spokesman for Mirae Asset Partners Private Equity Fund Co. Ltd. said an IPO had been planned since the 2011 acquisition for its exit in order to maximize shareholder value. The Korea Economic Daily reported that Acushnet was expected to complete listing by 2016, likely in New York, citing a high-ranking source at Mirae Asset. ” end quote.

      My guess is that the investors backing the Taiwan factory are fronting some of these smaller ball companies in some form or another as a strategy to diffuse the legal assault as they attempt to gain share. And as they have a vested interest in the outcome of any litigation in either case they will most likely also front some legal help to whichever of the ball companies that have demonstrated the best marketing savvy/share to date. Eventually reaching a settlement with Titleist much the same as Titleist has accepted in the past with other competitors.

      Conclusion – whether it’s oil or golf balls if you threaten artificially inflated revenue streams prepare for war.

      Reply

      Dan

      8 years ago

      The golf industry is a funny business, isn’t it. Poor old Karsten must roll in his grave every time he hear’s Scotty Cameron mentioned as the greatest putter designer of all time when really they’ve (Scotty & Titleist) built his franchise off the back of the Anser…. it started with a rip off plain & simple. And just how many of todays ‘innovations’ are really innovations of one companies making? Titleist market an adjustable/interchangeable driver but they certainly didn’t invent the concept… Taylor Made have been pushing their ‘slot’ technology in woods for the past couple of years but Adams actually developed that (which is probably why TM bought them), and now every major brand has some form of that slot design on their drivers/fairways etc…. so who’s IP is that (even if it is slightly tweaked)? While I agree whole heartedly that companies should be able to protect their designs & IP, it does seem Titleist are out to strangle the little guys with legal fees in this case. The ‘offending’ ball’s clearly have a different dimple pattern to Pro V1 & a different number of dimples. I’m no patent expert buy I’d say there’s enough difference not to violate so good luck to them… if the companies in question used Pro V1 as a reference point then I would argue that is no different to Titleist use of the Anser as a reference point for their Newport… so really, what’s the difference?

      Reply

      Ryan

      9 years ago

      Titleist has a lot of room to talk, since in 08/09 they were sued by callaway for stealing their patents, and callaway prevailed in 8 of the 9 claims, this is why I don’t play titleist, they are conceded a**holes.

      Reply

      Wayne Bosley

      9 years ago

      Just to add it was in 1990 that Titleist made their main claim to understanding that
      the number of dimples was not the significant factor more the effective coverage of
      the ball was the better design in regards to performance and was stated as their main
      improvement/ refinement to this original patent with the 1990 NEW DT and Tour lines,,,,,

      That is 25 years ago,,,,,no IP there,,,,,

      Reply

      Wayne Bosley

      9 years ago

      Up until 1983 most golf balls had either a 324 or 336 dimple pattern,,,the idea that
      Acushnet were given such a vague series of dimple patents to try and block competitors
      was not realistic when their ideas were already common industry knowledge around the
      world.

      Their main claim is not so much the numbers but the icosahedron / triangular dimple
      layout which dates back to the Acushnet introduction of it to the US market of it in 1973.

      This concept is now out of the patent timeline protection and is the basis of their action,
      they added newer patents to try and prolong this protection but they did not add to the
      original IP from what I can see,,,,,,

      So this is probably why they didn’t go after Wilson and some other the big players that
      have used the 318 pattern for many years,,,,

      The 336 pattern will be seen as the quick fix for Foremost as it has been in golf for
      many years and like the 324 and 432 patterns are almost generic in their current use,,

      Reply

      David T.

      9 years ago

      So…… let’s all play Wilson’s then! Well, Wilson Staff at least ;0)

      Reply

      Butch

      9 years ago

      BS! Companies patent developments all the time that they reserve for future use. Nothing new about that. “Fairness” has nothing to do with this business discussion. If you have a patentable idea, get a patent on that idea. If someone wants to mfg that product , they can pay you or not make it. Perhaps Titleist even bought those patents itself. And, anyone who plans to mfg something in as widespread use as a golf ball is a fool if they don’t have a patent lawyer do a search to determine if there is a possibility that they are infringing with their intended product. Maybe the new companies are not infringing, the courts will make that determination. In this day, your IP is an extremely valuable asset, you have to be viligent to protect it.

      Reply

      David Ash

      9 years ago

      The most interesting thing in all of this? NONE of Titleist’s golf balls have 318 dimples. Not the Pro V1 nor the Pro V1x/

      They claim to have a patent in place just in case anyone wants to make a ball between 250 and 370 dimples. This is an absurd case of bullying against tiny start ups that could never dream of competing with Titleist…ever.

      Reply

      Larry

      9 years ago

      Amazing. I checked your facts and you are correct. Why then is Titleist suing over a patent that seem to have no desire of ever putting into production? It sounds like that picked every dimple number possible and patented it. I agree..very unfair. There is no way that the production facility nor the ball manufacturers could have known in advance….they were probably all stamped the same and resold under different labels.

      Reply

      Wayne Bosley

      9 years ago

      Mirae Asset PE successfully acquired a collection of leading golf brands, including Titleist and Footjoy, and the transaction was voted “Best Korea Deal of the Year” by Finance Asia.
      (※ Total acquisition amount: US$1.2bn)

      Reply

      Wayne Bosley

      9 years ago

      Acushnet Company, Inc. Key Developments
      Acushnet Company Reportedly Plans IPO In 2016
      Jan 6 15
      Acushnet Company, Inc. is planning an initial public offering (IPO) and has selected Solebury Capital to advise the offering expected to be worth around $1.8 billion around 2016, a source with direct knowledge said. The sources stated that Solebury is exploring an early IPO and details on value and venue are yet to be decided. A spokesman for Mirae Asset Partners Private Equity Fund Co. Ltd. said an IPO had been planned since the 2011 acquisition for its exit in order to maximize shareholder value. The Korea Economic Daily reported that Acushnet was expected to complete listing by 2016, likely in New York, citing a high-ranking source at Mirae Asset.

      Reply

      JimmyO

      9 years ago

      Don’t forget that Titleist is in the process of an IPO. Cover your butt by protecting your IP while at the same time possibly eliminating fringe competition and you’re worth more as a company.

      Reply

      Butch

      9 years ago

      In ten years you will be lucky to even find a reference to ONCORE with a Google search!

      Reply

      harv harvison

      9 years ago

      Does that mean, those balls with other names are just as good as Titleist? Titleist should be more concerned about ONCORE’s new ball and their long term effect on their future sales to golfers. Time will tell, but its my prediction, in ten years, everyone will want a piece of Oncore’s design and closer to perfection ball!
      This is typical management at Titleist, instead of calling these guys (both manufacture and new band) on the phone and saying, try to come up with a new design, this is ours special patented design, they pull a publicity stunt with the media and try to use scare tactics. Can you imagine how long this court case would be? They would have to involve scientific jurors to look under the microscope. Since the manufacturing took place in Taiwan, then the trial should be there as well. They might not even have a jury system there. There’s so many fakes of the Titleist ball out there now, its a risk to even buy them. The only reason I carry them in the store is that some customers ask for them. Instead of spending millions of dollars in suing those guys, use those millions towards marketing and give special credits to customers lowering the price. If your ball is the best, then you shouldn’t have to pay any sponsorship, they should be coming to you and paying for the best. But the fact is, you’ve just been outdone by a new company. Oncore will take your share of the market in 10 years.

      Reply

      Butch

      9 years ago

      Man! This story has legs – who knew?

      Reply

      Mike

      9 years ago

      Msg since you are so pro consumer, you may want to warn your readers of scams like kick x golf balls. Dimple pattern aside kx is straight up lying about the free trial.

      Reply

      Jonny B.

      9 years ago

      If you want ProV1s for 1/2 the price, don’t buy them from a company who stole their technology like the 10 in this article. Buy the real things. Used AAAAA ProV1s are like $22/dozen online. I get them every year and they play exactly the same as new.

      Silly people…

      Reply

      ryebread

      9 years ago

      I have no “dog” in this fight. I don’t play Titelist balls and I don’t play any balls from those being sued. I have no affiliation in any way with any of these companies or to the golf industry.

      Two things jump out at me:
      1) I can visually see just in the pictures the differences in these balls. Simply put, the dimple sizes aren’t all the same across them. Is the basis of Titelist’s suit that these knock offs have 318 dimples with ridges in between them? I see the triangle ridges part, but guess what? When you put circles next to one another, you’re basically left with small triangles in the cut outs. I’m not a patent lawyer, but for Titelist to seemingly defend this successfully, they’re seemingly going to have to prove they have the patent than controls the magical count of 318 dimples.

      2) IP infringement is a big issue, and it’s a really big deal in China, etc.. It’s part of what makes Chinese businesses competitive. Other businesses should look at this closely when they’re thinking of using OEM design/manufacturing shops out of Asia. Patents exist for a reason. I am not sure that we really want to live in a world without them.

      While I don’t think that Titelist is worried about market share from these guys, I do think they’re indirectly sending a message to this manufacturer to knock it off. I don’t know the patents in question and haven’t read the 30 page document referenced. Maybe they have a strong case? Maybe they’re just drowning the little guys in legal proceedings that are too much overhead to deal with? My gut says it is the latter, but it could be the former as well. I guess it is really all in the actual patent.

      Reply

      Dave T

      9 years ago

      They key question here is what is Claimed in Titleist’s approved US patent?

      If the companies accused of infringement are violating that Claim then Titleist has a legal right to go after the infringing companies.

      Reply

      Ted

      9 years ago

      I think this has less to do with Titelist bullying or squeezing out some tiny companies whose total sales probably amount to nothing more than a rounding error in Acushnet’s bottom line, and more to do with simply protecting your IP from lapsing into the public domain.

      If they allow these companies to utilize their patented design unchallenged, it opens a door (one that cannot be closed again) for allowing Calloway, Srixon, or anyone else to legally manufacture their own copycat triangular dipyramid dimple patterned ball.

      Reply

      Mark

      9 years ago

      Good for Titleist. Ping should have done this over putter designs

      Reply

      kloyd0306

      9 years ago

      As usual, Titleist’s methods are heavy-handed. Their air of superiority puts me off. The fact that Bridgestone receives patent-infringement payments from Titleist tells me that their own business ethics are highly questionable.

      Reply

      Dave

      9 years ago

      The payments are called royalties, similar to rent. I believe what you are suggesting is welfare.

      Reply

      kloyd0306

      9 years ago

      No, royalties are voluntary. In Titleist’s case they lost (settled out of court because they knew they would lose) and were “required by agreement to pay for their infringement”).

      Welfare is received by non tax payers paid for by those who do pay taxes – a big difference.

      Titleist is trying to portray that these minion companies are hurting their business (they’re not) while Titleist’s own business practices and patent infringement is conveniently forgotten.

      When Titleist has to face a company like Bridgestone, they don’t look so tough.

      David

      9 years ago

      Could you not rephrase your welfare definition by replacing “tax payers/taxes” (mean one is working for an income) with “companies/R&D” (putting in an effort to make money)? In the end, the point is do people/companies/societies deserve to benefit from another’s effort with no compensation or incentive for the latter to try create their on benefit/idea? If this is the case, why would any one try their best?

      Wayne Bosley

      9 years ago

      Titleist have one ball plant outside of the US in Thailand making ProV1’s for
      Asia and the Pacific,,,,,,,

      FGI should have been the target but US law wouldn’t apply as they are not
      obliged to worry about a US patent when making balls in Taiwan.

      The other issue is the US patent office has approved many Acushnet patents
      that are very slight improvements if any on PRIOR designs, they shouldn’t have
      got out of jail with the Top-Flite/ProV1 case as their defence is the same as what
      all of these guys could do if they had deeper,,,the information in regards to their
      design was already common known industry knowledge when they applied for
      the patent! Look at the Japanese balls for the period prior to the art and there
      was already designs in place with the big dimple symetrical pattern concept.

      Titleist have never sold a 318 dimple pattern??

      This is a very general patent,,,,,,just enough to go to battle with I suppose,,,,

      Reply

      Wayne Bosley

      9 years ago

      I don’t understand why Wilson was excluded as they also run the same ball not their
      own designs as mentioned in a 318 pattern their own internal specs maybe ,,,was it because they have deeper legal pockets?

      The dimple pattern patent is something I thought was being licenced by Foremost
      Golf or FGI (Taiwan) the manufacturer from Acushnet as they have run this pattern
      around the world for a number of years,,,,

      Has this got something to do with the upcoming IPO?? Titleist have a mature
      market position and can only go backwards which would not help the story they
      will be telling the markets ,,,,the markets want growth potential not a company
      that is old school in its approach and holding on to its marketshare with a multi
      million dollar promotion budget that they would be afraid to reduce as there are
      now a number of similar type products from around the world.

      The ProV1 today plays very much like the ProV1 2000,,,,were is the innovation?

      I really feel sorry for these small guys as they would have thought they were
      protected by FGI ,,,who should have made sure they were making balls and
      selling them with an understanding that they were fine.

      Volvik also use FGI balls and they are not listed here,,,,,

      Reply

      Scud

      9 years ago

      I played in a club manufacturer’s media day just before the PGA Show this year. When we got to the 10th tee there were a couple of guys from Kick X balls standing there with a keg of beer.
      I asked them how their ball was better than Titleist. The guy, with a thick foreign accent, says, “better ball, lower price.” I thought to myself, you better have more than that if you’re going to succeed. They won’t, plus their on line advertising is highly misleading and that’s putting it mildly.

      Reply

      vegasgolfandsneakers

      9 years ago

      They must have some sales to be able to advertise on the Golf Channel as much as they do. Their biggest issue is their name. Kick X? Are they owned by the WWF? If I was going to play a smaller ball company, I’d play Snell most likely.

      Reply

      Julien C

      9 years ago

      I play 2 games with my friends, I order 5 dozen Vice Pro and I was giving to each one and they all love playing with this ball. I understand Titleist does not want other companies compies their patent, but at $ 50 for a dozen Pro V1 vs. 25$ per dozen for the Vice the same product, I’d rather pay cheaper and invest in a round the golf with my friends. Sorry for my bad english i’m from Quebec.

      Reply

      thomas murphy

      9 years ago

      It is the “big dog” or smaller dog nipping at heals Srixon/sumitomo rubber they are really after.

      Reply

      Butch

      9 years ago

      If big pharma companies could not depend on IP laws to protect their new drug development, no research would be performed and no new HIV drug would exist. $1000 pills beat no pills at all. The alternative would be to raise taxes and let the government give it a try – we would then hear “don’t raise my taxes to pay for treatment of (what many believe to be a self inflicted) a disease.” Profit is a not a dirty word. If Titleist golf balls did not represent a good value, no one would pay the asking price and the price would go down.

      Reply

      Al

      9 years ago

      First and foremost Titleist golf balls are made in the USA. They are the best ball made at this time. So the little guys like the Chinese feel it’s their right to make knock of golf balls or clubs the only difference being the little guys use different names for their knock offs

      Reply

      Rob Samson

      9 years ago

      I stopped using Titleist balls ever since they outsourced their products to South Korea. When I buy golf products I prefer to buy them from companies who make them in America. I fully understand these companies may have mistakenly used Titleist’s patent. The thing that has me shaking my head is how simple it is to look up a golf ball patent.

      Reply

      Rob Samson

      9 years ago

      Correction, Fila, who owns Titleist is a South Korean company. Balls are made in Thailand and China as others have said.

      Reply

      Rich in Tampa

      9 years ago

      Anyone ever play the VG3 by Titleist? I know it’s a Japan marketed ball, but I’ve played a round with it and it’s the longest ball I’ve ever played. They say it’s a cross between the NXT Tour and ProV1. It’s absurdly long off the tee.

      Reply

      FTWPhil

      9 years ago

      The current Pro V1 is made in Thailand. This may be a reason for the change.

      Reply

      Berniez40

      9 years ago

      I feel just a tad sorry for the other companies, as they are definitely the little monkeys in the room with the 800 pound gorilla. Unfortunately for them, they stole the Gorilla’s bananas, and now they must suffer the wrath of the gorilla. As for the guys that want to be different, or support the little guy—The Snell Ball, definitely a smaller company, and obviously not a part of this law suit, did extremely well in Golf Spy’s Golf Ball shootout. If I remember correctly, The Nicklaus Balls also fared very well in the aforementioned shootout. Both of them are respectable companies who produced a good product without pirating designs or patents. Support them if you wish, but don’t blame Titleist for defending something they spent a lot of money developing. They had to suffer the slings and arrows of court battles with the likes of Bridgestone and Callaway, and therefor have the right to inflict such damage on anyone who infringes on those patents.

      Reply

      BR

      9 years ago

      Intellectual Property of Titleist belongs to Titleist. Anyone else that is attempting to bring to market a “like” design should do their due diligence regarding research into existing patents.
      And should the smaller companies choose to market their products as equal to or better than a Titleist specific ball model then that kinda implies at the very least a general understanding regarding dimple design technologies.
      Regarding the pricing of expensive Titleist, I think the R&D invested along with marketing, etc explains the higher cost.
      I am glad there are alternative brands with a much lower cost model but I do enjoy receiving Titleist products as gifts………

      Reply

      Nick

      9 years ago

      I’m curious what is next in the relationship between Titleist and their ball manufacturer. If I’m all of these ball companies I’m looking at the common denominator, the manufacturer.
      Agree with Titleist or not they are within their rights to do this.
      I’m looking forward to the next chapter regarding this manufacturer.

      Reply

      Butch

      9 years ago

      What do you suggest Titleist do? Get some guns and go shoot them?

      Reply

      mike J

      9 years ago

      Titleist tour players cost a lot of money, ads in every golf publication costs money. Thus the difference in price of the ProV and the others.

      Reply

      R Morris

      9 years ago

      Fair is fair, but my opinion is Titleist could have filed a cease and desist to stop others from selling their IP. I have played the Vice ball, and honestly can’t tell the difference between it and a Pro V1 or RX330 or a Wilson Duo. Of course the only ball I hit far is the one that hits the sweet spot.

      Reply

      Butch

      9 years ago

      I do not work for Titlleist, but what difference would that make. If you can’t overcome the argument, then question the poster’s motives.

      Reply

      Bob

      9 years ago

      There usually is a motive when someone sticks up for large corps,

      Reply

      Gary

      9 years ago

      Yes, and that motive is respect for the legal rights of the owner of a patent.

      Butch

      9 years ago

      Bob, how would you feel if Rife held the patents and Titleist produced the knock offs? Titleist got to be large by producing good products – they were once a “little guy.”

      mnfats95

      9 years ago

      Large corporations get the same rights as everyone else.

      Your argument seems to be that since they are a large corporation they are not worthy of same rights to protect their IP as a small company?

      The reason they sell their golf balls at the highest price is because people will pay for them at that price.

      If anyone tries to steal from them then they have the right to go after them regardless of who they are.

      Even if the manufacturer is the one who caused this issue by using a copyrighted design, ultimately wouldn’t it be the responsibility of their customers to sue them to pay Titleist instead of Titleist suing the manufacturer?

      Bob

      9 years ago

      In our sue happy world, legally your right but that doesn’t make it riight

      Reply

      Bob

      9 years ago

      So titleist says this is their pro v ball, Hmmmm, this seems like a good time to stock up on low priced pro v’s while they are still available

      Reply

      Butch

      9 years ago

      And, if you don’t like the price, don’t buy them. The “little guys” are thieves: they can count dimples as well as the factory.

      Reply

      Butch

      9 years ago

      This issue has nothing to do with “greed” (except on the part of the copycats) and everything to do with “theft” of intellectual property. Let’s see how sad you feel when you spend millions on R&D and advertising then some on-line opportunist just sells a knock off product that copies yours. If you do not agressively protect your IP, you soon lose it.

      Reply

      Bob

      9 years ago

      I’ll bet you work for titleist

      Reply

      blstrong (SeeRed)

      9 years ago

      I have no skin in this game, but I am inclined to agree. If the smaller companies in question did, in fact, infringe on Titleist/Acushnet patents or IP, shame on them. It’s up to the business owner to know whether or not their products can be legitimately sold as their own. Hard to feel too badly for those who didn’t do their homework, especially if their business depended on it.

      Reply

      DB

      9 years ago

      Most interesting is that these balls are apparently made in the same factory as Titleist.

      One company charges $25. The other charges $48. Huh.

      Reply

      David W

      9 years ago

      So they are suing the little man who doesn’t even put a dent in their wallets but not the manufacturer (who they use and need to keep creating their balls) who is the one who actually used the technology without Titleist’s permission. Sour taste in my mouth towards Titleist on this one, big guy stomping on the little man and pounding his chest.

      Reply

      Dave S

      9 years ago

      Yeah, god forbid small company thieves be held to the same standard as big company thieves. If they were suing Callaway, you wouldn’t give a crap. And guess what? Titleist started as a small company as well.

      Reply

      Bob

      9 years ago

      Titleist charges $15 to $20 more per dozen than the little guy for balls made in the same factory either titleist needs a better deal from manufacturer or they should drop their price, end of problem. But nooooo they sue showing everyone how greedy they really are, it’s nice to play a titleist ball, but I’m not a scratch player and I don’t really see a diffrence in my scores if I use another decent quality ball so my advice don’t give your money to the greedy b***ards

      Reply

      Dave

      9 years ago

      This seems similar to the pharmaceutical industry. Initial high pricing to help oat R&D and pull in a profit. Once IP runs out, the flood gates open and the generics come in. The real question may be, how long should the IP/patents last for?

      Reply

      Bob

      9 years ago

      When a pharmaceutical company has a new wonder drug for hiv and charges close to $1000 a pill when 0.8 percent of the world population is infected do you still stand by those patent laws or do you think maybe something is wrong with the system

      Dave T

      9 years ago

      Patents last for 17 years from the time the application is turned in.

      Clay

      9 years ago

      Please stop adding “gate” to the end of a word for every controversy that comes up.

      Reply

      Dave S

      9 years ago

      If Titleist has a valid patent on that dimple design and the other companies are blatantly copying it, then yes, Titleist has every right to go after and subsequently crush them. That’s the way intellectual property works; you can’t look at the size of the companies involved, you have to look at it in a vacuum, only comparing the products.

      Reply

      David W

      9 years ago

      Why go after the little man and not the manufacturer who provided this technology to them? Because they need the manufacturer and they don’t need the little man. Bullying plain and simple.

      Reply

      Tony Covey

      9 years ago

      One of the issues is that it’s difficult to sue a Taiwanese company in a US court. This is a US patent (not technically a world patent), and so while the Taiwanese company is probably at fault, it’s the small golf ball companies who are allegedly infringing on the patent since they’re the ones actually selling the balls within the confines of the United States.

      The question I find myself asking is why are people buying these products at all? Yeah, I get that it can be cool to move against the grain, fight the man, and whatnot, but fundamentally what’s the real performance proposition these guys offer?

      They aren’t doing their own design work. They’re not doing their own manufacturing, and they clearly didn’t do their due diligence. Essentially they’re apparently selling a product they know little about…and selling it as their own. What’s the real point of that? Why as a golfer should I be drawn to that?

      I’m not a big fan of big companies trying to squash little ones, but what’s the number? I mean how much money should a small company be able to make from a bigger company’s intellectual property before we decided that, unintentional or otherwise, stealing is stealing?

      Philip

      9 years ago

      I play INeedTheBall. I switched because I didn’t destroy the cover like I did on ProV1. I’d chew a ProV1 up in about half a round. Loved them, but that’s just crazy. So there must be some differences.

      Bob

      9 years ago

      So your ok with being over charged $20 a dozen for the same ball according to titleist

      Reply

      Dave S

      9 years ago

      David W – that may be true, but it’s irrelevant to the patent infringement. The poor “little guy” decided to underhandedly steal and subvert Titleist’s patent so I don’t feel bad for them at all.

      Bob – I don’t play Titleist golf balls, but again, that’s how intellectual property works. If they developed a technological advantage through their own R&D, then they have the right to be compensated for it. Not have the market driven down by cheaters.

      Bob

      9 years ago

      Legally yes your right morally titleist loses if a company can sell the same product $20 cheaper and make a profit, only a fool would continue to pay the higher price for an overpriced product

      Dave S

      9 years ago

      Bob – I think what you’re missing here is that the balls Titleist are producing AREN’T overpriced. These smaller manufacturers are UNDERPRICING their ball b/c they stole the patented tech that Titleist no doubt invested hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of dollars in R&D developing. Liberally paraphrasing Tony above: only a fool would buy a product from a company that knows nothing about what it’s selling and who’s moral compass is spinning like they’re at the north pole.

      Gary McCormick

      9 years ago

      Titleist has invested considerable amounts of money in research and development in their golf ball designs, not to mention the costs of obtaining patents; the small companies have not — they just pay the Taiwanese manufacturer to produce the ball for them. I’m not saying that Titleist isn’t making a barrel of money on golf ball sales, nor am I saying that they couldn’t reduce their prices a bit — but they own the rights to the design, and they have invested in the design, neither of which the small companies have done.

      The folks at Titleist may not be taking public action (lawsuit) against the Taiwanese manufacturer, but I wouldn’t be surprised to find that they are extracting some concessions from them behind closed doors.

      Bob

      9 years ago

      Let me see if I got this right your saying titleist is getting concessions ( lower price) so they can make larger profit plus sue the little guys for millions and not pass anything on to the consumer and your saying this is capitatilsm at it shining moment

      Gary

      9 years ago

      I have no idea what the concessions (if any) might be. This is all speculation on my part, you understand, but I can see the Taiwanese manufacturer wanting to avoid the public embarrassment of a lawsuit and therefore working a deal of some sort with Acushnet. If I were the folks at Titleist I would certainly be putting the Taiwanese companies feet to the fire for this!

      The bottom line is that Acushnet/Titleist is the legal owner of the design, and they have every right to compensation or redress is someone is using it without permission. Just because they are a large, successful company does not make it OK for “little guys” to steal from them. They were a startup once, too.

      Dave S

      9 years ago

      Bob – this isn’t a referendum on Titleist’s pricing strategies. You can dislike a company for charging what the market is willing to pay (last time I checked, Pro V1s aren’t exactly hurting Titleist’s bottom line) if you want. But that doesn’t change the fact that this lawsuit is about other companies STEALING their R&D and profiting from it without any compensation. THAT is the issue here. If you don’t like Titleist balls or think they cost too much, don’t buy them. Simple. I’m sure Titleist won’t lose sleep over it and you shouldn’t either.

      Don

      9 years ago

      I’m all for these small direct sales ball manufacturers but not if they are going to steal the IP of another company. Intentionally or not. So I’m all for Titleist sticking up for it’s IP rights.

      Good question Gary. Probably not long at all.

      Reply

      Edward

      9 years ago

      My opinion is that, as always with Titleist and its hordes of acolytes, this is just plain bullshit and they are trying to bully the small companies before they grow.
      A clear example of David vs Goliath.

      Reply

      Alex

      9 years ago

      I love Titleist balls so I hope this is not the case. My guess would honestly be that they don’t wish to set a precedent of allowing other manufacturers to use their IP. Once they have turned a blind a eye to a few manufacturers infringing on their patents it becomes increasingly difficult to enforce in the future.
      Plus, you don’t maintain the status of #1 by allowing other companies to compete with you by using your IP’s/patents.
      It’s unfortunate to see it come to a suit but i can’t say i blame them.

      Reply

      Gary McCormick

      9 years ago

      Next question is: How long before one of the companies named in the Titleist suit take action against the Taiwanese manufacturer for putting them in this jackpot?

      Reply

      David W

      9 years ago

      Hopefully very soon since the manufacturer is who Titleist should be going after and just asking for an injunction against the other guys to stop selling the balls.

      Reply

      Deuce

      9 years ago

      It would be supremely stupid for Titleist to go after the manufacturer since – well – they manufacture balls for Titleist. You put them out of business and who makes your golf ball for you?

      Sam Linville

      9 years ago

      Titleist Balls are not made by a Tiawan co. They make their own balls in tiawan cause they own factory

      Eric

      9 years ago

      More importantly, how exactly do you sue a company based in Taiwan in a US court? Don’t think its possible.

      Danny H

      9 years ago

      Hey Guys, The relationship between the Titleist and this ball manufacture is beyond your imagination. Those manufactures for the golf industry no matter in Taiwan or in China are “ACTUALLY” run by a very very small community. Things in here just don’t work in that way as you think in US.

      Duncan

      9 years ago

      I think the Prov1x is basically the best ball in the game. I play it. That said, my gut reaction to this is sadness. It seems like overkill from Titliest, greed I guess. Let the little guys die on their own.

      Reply

      David W

      9 years ago

      You should try the Snell ball (not a part of this). My buddy who is a positive handicap plays the ProV1 X. I gave him one of my Snell balls ($32 a dozen) to try and he said he couldn’t tell any difference. He continues to play the ProV1 X because he gets them free from his company.

      Reply

      Philip

      9 years ago

      How do you find the cover holds up vs the ProV1? I left ProV1 because I would chew through them in half a round. Love the ball, but can’t justify that many.

      Ron

      9 years ago

      I think Titleist would’ve let it go considering the sales volume. However, when Kick X started a flood of TV ads claiming their ball was superior to anything else (based on Titleist technology) they didn’t have a choice. The other 9 are just collateral damage.

      Reply

    Leave A Reply

    required
    required
    required (your email address will not be published)

    This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.

    News
    Apr 18, 2024
    Amazon Finds: The Callaway Swing Easy
    Best Drivers for Low Swing Speeds Best Drivers for Low Swing Speeds
    Drivers
    Apr 17, 2024
    Best Drivers For Low Swing Speed Golfers
    First Look
    Apr 17, 2024
    Malbon Is At It Again, This Time With Jimmy Choo
    ENTER to WIN 3 DOZEN

    Titleist ProV1 Golf Balls

    Titleist ProV1 Golf Balls
    By signing up you agree to receive communications from MyGolfSpy and select partners in accordance with our Privacy Policy You may opt out of email messages/withdraw consent at any time.